In this special episode of The Magic of Kanab, host Hal and special guest Camille chat about their favorite moments of season one. They are joined by both new and returning guests to discuss some of the highlights from show, as well as share some exciting bonus content. Relive some of this season’s biggest moments, involving fierce women, famous actors, dinosaurs, slot canyons, and much more.

“The fact that we’re so well connected, we have so many interesting stories and so many amazing people — that’s the magic of Kanab. This podcast is really a great way to highlight it.” -Emily Bentley

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The Magic of Kanab is a part of the Destination Marketing Podcast Network. It is hosted by Hal Johnson and produced by the team at Relic.

To learn more about the Destination Marketing Podcast Network and to listen to our other shows, please visit If you are interested in becoming a part of the network, please email


Hal Johnson: [00:00:00] You were listening to the Magic of Kanab Podcast, part of the Destination Marketing Podcast Network. Hi and welcome to our recap of Season 1 of the Magic of Kanab. We’re going to talk about anecdotes and stories and things we discussed during Season 1. We had 10 episodes and we’ve got a few people here that we’re going to get updates from as well as some questions. And we’re excited to talk tonight. We’ve got finger foods and food here and it’s kind of a festive activity. They’re trying to be quiet in the back corner and doing a pretty good job as of right now. So, and I’ve got with me Camille Johnson Taylor, office of Tourism Director. 

Camille Johnson: [00:00:38] Hello, hello, super happy to be here. 

Hal Johnson: [00:00:41] Yeah, and we have Katie with Relic here with us. Katie is just going to be behind the scenes here a little bit, but she’s helping us out. Here in just a minute, we’re going to be talking with Duane Baird. 

Duane Baird: [00:00:53] Got it. 

Hal Johnson: [00:00:55] Oh man. So, and we’ll bring him in here in just a minute. Anyway, so we’re excited. We’re super excited. We enjoyed Season 1. Camille. Did you enjoy it? 

Camille Johnson: [00:01:03] I loved it. I had so much fun. I learned some new things. I thought I knew a lot about our destination but I learned some great things that still just make me smile. 

Hal Johnson: [00:01:12] Yeah, same here. In fact, there’s many times when we’re doing, you know, a little 10- or 20-minute segment and I knew that we have time-sensitive. I thought I’ll just keep going, just keep going, just tell these stories. They’re so fun and I learned so much too. 

Camille Johnson: [00:01:25] Well, I think I did that when Dr. Titus was on. I just could dig deep. You know, I had so much fun talking to him and we actually need to do a follow-up. He is willing to hike with us out to Flag Point, but we can talk about that a little later. 

Hal Johnson: [00:01:39] Wow. Let’s definitely talk about that. And, you know, I have to say I was jealous of that one. I could not do that podcast that day. When I listened to you interview Dr. Titus, I was so jealous. 

Camille Johnson: [00:01:52] He is so, it has so many fun facts and I definitely gloated a little bit to how I was like you missed out. You should have been there. 

Hal Johnson: [00:02:01] I took some small consolation. I said, well, you know, Camille, your great interview Dr. Titus was great. You’re a little slap-happy. 

Camille Johnson: [00:02:07] I was a little slap-happy. 

Hal Johnson: [00:02:08] I might have been able to do a little bit. 

Camille Johnson: [00:02:10] I have a little hero worship with Dr. Titus. He’s just cool. 

Hal Johnson: [00:02:14] Oh, sure. Well, I think what we’re going to do is, just kind of go down through our episodes. We’ve invited a few people to chime in with us here for a few minutes, so we’ll call them up a little bit one at a time. Duane, welcome back. 

Duane Baird: [00:02:27] Thank you. Glad to be back. 

Hal Johnson: [00:02:28] Good, good. 

Camille Johnson: [00:02:29] Duane got some updates when we recorded that podcast. North Coyote Buttes. The Wave had just gone online. There was traditionally an advanced lottery online and then there was a walk-in lottery here in Kanab, but that went online. There’s an update because there’s an adjacent property to it called South County Buttes. And there’s an update on that as well. 

Duane Baird: [00:02:52] Yeah. So what we’ve done is we’ve also gone online with the South Coyote Buttes. It’s the same format as the North Coyote Buttes. You still have to be within what we call the geo fence that’s in within the area of Kanab and Page. We’re still same numbers for drawing for daily and advance on the South Coyote Buttes. We haven’t changed that at all but it has increased the number of applications for it, which has been really nice. We’re seeing an increase on the visitors for that. 

The daily income for the daily draw for the North, we’ve also seen a pretty good increase for the day over from last year. 

Hal Johnson: [00:03:29] Interesting. 

Camille Johnson: [00:03:29] It really expands the area that you can be in an imply for those two permits. 

Hal Johnson: [00:03:32] Yeah. Well, the North was pretty busy when we spoke last time there was a lot of people trying to get in there. Right? 

Duane Baird: [00:03:39] Yeah. 

Hal Johnson: [00:03:39] It’s even increasing more. 

Duane Baird: [00:03:41] Yeah, we’re still getting a lot of people coming in through it with the numbers. It’s really impressive. The only downfall everybody has is I don’t get picked. That’s the biggest complaint I ever get. 

Camille Johnson: [00:03:50] It’s hard not to be picked. There’s so much emotion involved in that. But the thing that I’ve always said, and I know gets repeated is even if you don’t win, you haven’t lost. Like, there’s so many cool things to do here. 

Duane Baird: [00:04:03] Absolutely. 

Camille Johnson: [00:04:02] Have a plan B. 

Duane Baird: [00:04:04] Oh, yeah, definitely. We have Plan B, C and all that for that going out on those hikes. It’s wonderful. We’ve had some really good visitors come through and give me some really great stories about their trips out there. You know, I’ve heard the traditional, I’ve been trying for 10 years and never got in and this is my first. I’ve had folks come through who’ve tried once and that’s it and they’re in. 

Camille Johnson: [00:04:25] You know what, I don’t know if I brought this up before, but I was one of those people when I first moved back to Kanab, grew up here, left while came back, I had heard about the wave. I didn’t know about it growing up. Did you Hal? 

Hal Johnson: [00:04:35] We didn’t call it The Wave. Cockscomb. Up by Cockscomb, I think we called it and just some cool rock formations that’s about as specific as we got. 

Camille Johnson: [00:04:43] We didn’t really know it was called The Wave. 

Hal Johnson: [00:04:46] No it’s called Cockscomb. 

Camille Johnson: [00:04:46] Okay. Fine. Geez. Alright. It’s called the Cockscomb but I applied for it and this was in February, it was cold, it wasn’t snowing wet as it is this year, but I applied for it and I won. So I got to take my kids out there. I did, I was like, well, that was easy. That was quite unusual. 

Hal Johnson: [00:05:06] Well, Duane you mentioned Plan B and actually I deal with a lot of those folks. So I take tours out, take people at the various destinations and some of them they’re just a little bit still a little sore that they couldn’t get in on that wave hike. But we quickly turn it around and have a blast with them. A lot of fun and they’re thrilled some of the things they can see alternatively. 

Duane Baird: [00:05:23] Yeah. Even though The Wave is the popular hike that everybody wants to do it is only one portion of the North Coyote Buttes that you can go to see. But the South Coyote Buttes and the White Pocket even those are all wonderful locations out there. They’re beautiful in their own right. And so I tell everybody, you may have a favorite of the three and some people will say The Wave is their most favorite. Others will say, it’s White Pocket or South Coyote Buttes. But it’s all a personal opinion when you get out to it because you have a different experience at each location. 

Hal Johnson: [00:05:55] Right. 

Camille Johnson: [00:05:55] You know, I’m one of those that I actually say I like the White Pocket or White Pocket better than The Wave just because in the different seasons it can change so much. One of my favorite experiences out at White Pocket was in November and there was no water in the holes and they had frozen and there was a lot of algae in there. So they look like little green emeralds all over White Pocket. And then it started to do this light snow. So I felt like I was like in this magical snow globe and that’s just a one-off experience. It’s different every time I go out there. 

Duane Baird: [00:06:29] Yeah, it is a wonderful experience. My first time out the White Pocket was just amazing. I got to sit on a rock for an hour by myself and the rest of the group walked away because I just said I’m done walking. 

Camille Johnson: [00:06:40] Yeah, and sometimes you just need to let it all settle in. Just enjoy your senses, what you smell, what you see, what you don’t hear. It is pretty quiet out there. 

Duane Baird: [00:06:48] It is wonderful. But we’ve had a lot of good use this year from the visitors coming into the area. We’ve had a lot of increase in people coming and doing the orientation in the morning, which has the safety briefing, which we’re really grateful. We’ve had a lot of advanced winners coming and doing that. We’ve kind of pushed hard for that to get more folks coming for that. We encourage anybody who does come in with a winning permit to go ahead and attend those meetings in the morning either here in Kanab or out at Page. We offered also out there and both of them are excellent resources for you to get out to The Wave safely and back out. 

Hal Johnson: [00:07:21] So Duane, if they don’t do that, what’s the alternative that they can? 

Duane Baird: [00:07:24] Well, we like to tell people if you’re not experienced enough to go out by yourself, I definitely say get a guide, hire guide service. Most of our services here in town are able to do something within a 24-hour period of time for getting a permit. You get a permit; you can go out. 

Camille Johnson: [00:07:40] I just want, that’s been particularly important this year with it being so wet and cold. It’s not just the cool experience, but sometimes it’s an access issue. And so, yeah, when in doubt, hire a guide and it’s just an amazing experience. 

Duane Baird: [00:07:54] They know what they’re doing out there. 

Hal Johnson: [00:07:57] So, Duane, one quick question. 

Duane Baird: [00:07:58] Sure. 

Hal Johnson: [00:07:58] What’s the difference between applying for the North in the South? It’s an update, right? You mentioned a little bit, but specifically what is the difference between the two? 

Duane Baird: [00:08:05] Just that they’re both online now. The numbers are, we’re still at 10 online for advanced and 10 daily. So it’s either 4 groups we can send out or 10 people. We haven’t changed the numbers but we’ve just, other than that four groups now. 

Camille Johnson: [00:08:21] And Duane, do you know? Sorry, I’m adding a final question but the odds of winning South Coyote Buttes are probably much greater. 

Duane Baird: [00:08:30] They are. I would venture to say right now we’re running about probably 20% or better. I’m not getting a lot of permits out for their right now, but the weather has been really wonderful lately for us. So the road conditions haven’t been good. 

Hal Johnson: [00:08:45] A couple of beautiful days and we’ll have a crazy storm come in, but it’s been a lot of really nice days. 

Duane Baird: [00:08:50] Yeah, it’s been fun and you know, we’ll still be here to help out when anybody comes into the Visitor Center and we’re excited to have them. We’ll help you get through any adventure you want to do it. 

Hal Johnson: [00:09:00] And I can tell he means that I know Duane a little bit and he is very sincere and very, very helpful. So we appreciate you coming in. 

Duane Baird: [00:09:06] Thank you for having me. I really appreciate it. 

Camille Johnson: [00:09:08] Yeah, thank you so much. Good to visit with you again. 

Duane Baird: [00:09:10] Just looking forward to seeing people in our office. 

Camille Johnson: [00:09:12] Thanks, Duane. 

Duane Baird: [00:09:13] Thank you. Bye. 

Hal Johnson: [00:09:14] Take care. TC Callister is a local tour guide, local entrepreneur. The name of the business again that you have here in town. It’s –? 

TC Callister: [00:09:21] It’s Sava. 

Hal Johnson: [00:09:22] Sava, yeah and that’s been a couple of years now, right? 

TC Callister: [00:09:26] A little over two years. Yeah. Yeah. And that’s really Pam’s baby. Yeah, that’s her juice and smoothie shop. 

Camille Johnson: [00:09:33] He’s looking at his partner right now across the room. 

Hal Johnson: [00:09:36] Big smiles, going back and forth. Good to see. We’re talking to you about Dan Dillman and Montezuma’s Treasure. 

TC Callister: [00:09:43] Yes. 

Hal Johnson: [00:09:43] And of course, there was the episode that aired about a year ago, the episode of the season. 

TC Callister: [00:09:48] This whole season, yeah. 

Hal Johnson: [00:09:49] And we had Dan Dillman, we were fortunate to get him on one of our interviews, but there’s still some stuff going on. Right. You’re involved with Dan. 

TC Callister: [00:09:55] There is some stuff and I was involved with the, with the History Channel series a little bit. Dan has wanted to kind of keep going with that away from the History Channel. So he’s been doing some independent filming and, and we found some pretty interesting stuff that – 

Camille Johnson: [00:10:12] What? Can you tell us? 

TC Callister: [00:10:14] That’s what am trying to think. I’m trying to think what I want to tell you. 

Camille Johnson: [00:10:16] It’s a private property that you can’t access if you’re not staying there or you’re going on tour. So it’s private property. 

TC Callister: [00:10:22] It’s a private property. We found some pretty interesting stuff that we’ve been excavating. We did run into some water. So we got flooded out. So we’re kind of waiting now to see if that’s going to dry out. 

Camille Johnson: [00:10:36] Oh this is so Montezuma’s Treasure going on right now. There’s a lot of obstacles when you’re pursuing this treasure. 

TC Callister: [00:10:43] There is. 

Hal Johnson: [00:10:43] It’s never been easy. 

TC Callister: [00:10:45] And Dan is very, I don’t want to say obsessed. He’s very passionate. 

Camille Johnson: [00:10:50] He’s got gold fever. Let’s face it. 

TC Callister: [00:10:52] It’s not even the gold. Dan really wants to just get the story out and get the history out. 

Hal Johnson: [00:10:58] Well, That’s right. He was a fascinating interview when we had him in here and just a wealth of information history and just had such a good attitude, really enjoyable. 

Camille Johnson: [00:11:06] He’s definitely got a good energy about it. And he’s a delight to be around. 

TC Callister: [00:11:08] Oh he really is. 

Hal Johnson: [00:11:11] His grandpa’s one that kind of started this search in the family. Right? Dad

TC Callister: [00:11:13] His dad, his grandpa and his uncle. 

Hal Johnson: [00:11:16] Yeah. 

TC Callister: [00:11:16] And now it’s him and his son and I’m happy to be a part of it now. It’s exciting. 

Camille Johnson: [00:11:25] Have you ever pictured like, what if we find it? 

TC Callister: [00:11:28] Just about every day? Yeah. 

Camille Johnson: [00:11:31] I was just kind of like going through this mental image of like coming upon it and just like the euphoria in disbelief and being so surreal. 

TC Callister: [00:11:42] Right and it would be amazing. 

Camille Johnson: [00:11:43] Can you imagine trying to contain that news though in this small town? 

Hal Johnson: [00:11:45] Well, and I’m sitting there thinking, do you shop for Islands in the Caribbean? 

TC Callister: [00:11:49] I’ve already been shopping. 

Hal Johnson: [00:11:50] Have you? 

Camille Johnson: [00:11:52] You got to purchase list if you find it. 

TC Callister: [00:11:54] Yeah, window shopping. 

Hal Johnson: [00:11:57] You can lend the horde to a museum now and again or something. But, part of that you don’t sell. 

TC Callister: [00:12:02] Yeah. 

Camille Johnson: [00:12:03] I kind of feel like it’s going to be one of those scenarios where the pure in heart will find or unearth the treasure or unwater. 

TC Callister: [00:12:11] Unwater, unsink. I don’t know. 

Camille Johnson: [00:12:15] Is that still kind of the active theory that it’s buried below a body of water? 

TC Callister: [00:12:20] That’s one of the theories. Yeah. 

Camille Johnson: [00:12:21] Okay. So, do you have a scuba suit on hand just in case or? 

TC Callister: [00:12:26] We have divers on here. 

Camille Johnson: [00:12:28] Do you? Okay. 

TC Callister: [00:12:28] Yeah. 

Hal Johnson: [00:12:30] That was an interesting episode. 

TC Callister: [00:12:32] And we did have the film crew out or the camera crew from the History Channel recently. They did some filming for us? 

Camille Johnson: [00:12:38] Oh they came back?

TC Callister: [00:12:40] Not with the History channel. They’re just independent and we filmed a little bit. So you when that’s going to come out — 

Camille Johnson: [00:12:48] You were holding back a lot. 

Hal Johnson: [00:12:49] I can tell, you can totally tell he’s saving the reveal. He’s like, I can’t. 

Camille Johnson: [00:12:53] We need to break out the pocket watch. Hypnotize him. 

TC Callister: [00:12:57] You’re going to have to wait till you see it on the television. 

Camille Johnson: [00:12:59] Oh man, get some truth syrup on the television. Oh, man. Okay. So when is it going to come out or where is it going to be released? 

TC Callister: [00:13:05] That? So it’s not even finished yet. So we’ve got a lot of filming to do. 

Camille Johnson: [00:13:08] Okay, so future episode. 

TC Callister: [00:13:11] Future show… 

Camille Johnson: [00:13:12] Montezuma part 2. 

TC Callister: [00:13:13] Yes. 

Hal Johnson: [00:13:14] There you go. I like it. You know, I have to say you mentioned the pure in heart Camille, I think that fits TC. I think I know him pretty well. What do you think Pam? 

Camille Johnson: [00:13:25] Pure in heart?

TC Callister: [00:13:27] She’s the pure one. 

Camille Johnson: [00:13:30] She brings the purity. 

Hal Johnson: [00:13:31] She’s smiling big and I can’t quite interpret that smile, but I think I’m right. 

Camille Johnson: [00:13:36] I think she knows stuff too, man. We need to get with these two off there. 

TC Callister: [00:13:39] Pam was actually a part of it also. So she was there, her and her brother brought their heavy equipment up, did some excavating for us. 

Hal Johnson: [00:13:49] So the water, was that there when you were actually excavating or did that come in later from the storms? 

TC Callister: [00:13:52] No, the water broke loose while we were digging. 

Camille Johnson: [00:13:56] Wow. 

TC Callister: [00:13:57] Maybe a water trap or maybe just a natural spring. We don’t really know yet. 

Camille Johnson: [00:14:02] I’m looking at the producer. Can you add some dramatic music there? 

Hal Johnson: [00:14:08] Well, so fun to have you come in. Thank you. 

Camille Johnson: [00:14:12] Yes. Thank you too, TC.

Hal Johnson: [00:14:14] We look forward to — 

Camille Johnson: [00:14:15] There’s people here that want to clap. They can clap. Go ahead and clap for TC. 

TC Callister: [00:14:21] I might let you know when we find something. 

Camille Johnson: [00:14:22] Hey, yes, make sure you have my number. Just slip a little coin in your pocket. 

TC Callister: [00:14:28] There you go. 

Camille Johnson: [00:14:31] Yeah, that’s all I ask. 

TC Callister: [00:14:31] Well thanks for having me, guys. 

Camille Johnson: [00:14:32] Awesome. Thank you, TC. Appreciate it. 

Hal Johnson: [00:14:34] Thanks so much. Montezuma’s treasure. That’s always a fascinating, fascinating topic. I think every kid that grows up around here grows up hearing that lower. And if you spend time out in the hills, you’re thinking it’s going to be me. 

Camille Johnson: [00:14:48] You just kind of hope that you could just like after a rainstorm, you’ll see a nurse and you’ll be like, oh my gosh, there is a massive gold deposit. Actually, my son so even before we moved back to Kanab, I’ve been back 11 years whenever he’d bring his friends down here from Northern Utah, he would always have me tell his friends about Montezuma folklore. Mom, tell him about Montezuma’s treasure. So it’s definitely fascinating. 

Hal Johnson: [00:15:13] It’s well known. You know, even when I’m out doing tours, I have people say, this is the area, right? And I’ll say not only is this the area, but the canyon we’re in is a prime candidate and part of the search. 

Camille Johnson: [00:15:22] It’s wild. I can’t even imagine. I would hope that if it’s found it would be on museum display. 

Hal Johnson: [00:15:29] Amen. Thank you, TC, for coming in. Then we are– the third episode we discussed was Little Hollywood. 

Camille Johnson: [00:15:35] Yes, this was actually probably my favorite episode. 

Hal Johnson: [00:15:39] You know I might be right there with you. 

Camille Johnson: [00:15:40] Yeah, I really just enjoyed hearing the content from Dennis Judd. Dennis Judd is like the father of tourism in Kane County. He had Denny’s Wigwam. He welcomed tour buses from all over the world, had a really amazing dining and skit experience, a shop. But he had some great stories about his youth growing up in Kanab working on the movies. 

Hal Johnson: [00:16:05] I know. And along those lines, we have a special guest with us here today, Ray Shell Aldridge. Welcome, Rachel. 

Camille Johnson: [00:16:11] Welcome, Ray Shell. 

Ray Shell: [00:16:11] Hello. 

Hal Johnson: [00:16:12] She is a participant in a lot of our local filming. She’s done a lot of well in the production side and she is in commercials and feature films and on the backside. Why am I talking about Ray Shell? So just launch in, what’s your experience? 

Camille Johnson: [00:16:26] She has some really cool stories to share. I know listeners love to hear about Kevin Costner. 

Hal Johnson: [00:16:32] We should start with Kevin Costner.

Camille Johnson: [00:16:34] Let’s start with Kevin. Oh, Kev. 

Ray Shell: [00:16:37] Uncle Kev is what I call him. 

Camille Johnson: [00:16:40] Oh, I love that. 

Ray Shell: [00:16:41] So I just had to take him out food one day, meet him in the middle of nowhere. Someone told me to go pick up food. I didn’t know who I was picking it up for. So when I show up, I just thought it was a film crew. I was just like, oh, it’s just a normal film crew. Just bringing him lunch, whatever. And then all of a sudden, he comes out and I’m like, oh my God, it’s Kevin Costner. And I was like, you’re kidding me? 

Hal Johnson: [00:17:05] Did you do budget shopping? And what kind of lunch did you take Kevin Costner? 

Ray Shell: [00:17:07] He loves Escobar’s. 

Camille Johnson: [00:17:09] Oh, our Mexican restaurant here. 

Ray Shell: [00:17:12] He very much eats there I think every time he comes in town. So the two times that I know for sure. Yeah. So he walks up and he’s like, hi. He like walked up right away because he noticed I was new onset. So he was like, thank you so much for bringing our food. What is your name? And I was so stunned. So I was like, Ray Shell and I was just like, oh, great. I was like, my mom always gets on me for make sure they say your name right. So like we go back to the hotel and he makes someone share their lunch with me. Like he says come eat lunch with us

Camille Johnson: [00:17:43] That’s so sweet and thoughtful. 

Ray Shell: [00:17:44] Yeah. Come eat lunch with us. So we go to eat lunch and a little bit later, probably 20 minutes later someone is like, oh Rochelle here and he’s like, it’s Ray Shell and I was like, and the person looks at me. Like, who are you? 

Camille Johnson: [00:17:59] I’m a big deal. 

Ray Shell: [00:18:01] I don’t know. He just really wants you to pronounce my name right. And I was like, oh, you’re my mom’s favorite person. 

Camille Johnson: [00:18:08] That’s awesome. I wonder if that’s kind of his style is to just learn people’s names, remember them because I’m always impressed by people who can do that. 

Hal Johnson: [00:18:17] No kidding. And I’ve heard nothing but good about him. I mean, a perfect gentleman and very kind and so Ray Shell I got to ask you 20 minutes later, were you still shell-shocked? Could you converse a little bit? Could you say two words? 

Ray Shell: [00:18:28] I could converse a little bit. I ended up telling him that I would just like I told my daughter, h Kevin Costner’s in town and she was 12 at the time. She was like, who the heck’s Kevin Costner? And I was like Dances with Wolves and she’s like, what’s Dances with Wolves? And I was like, so I told him that story and he thought it was a great story and he’s like, well, that’s a great age to be watching that movie to be learning about that, learning about the indigenous people and all that. 

Camille Johnson: [00:18:52] I didn’t have the nerve to tell him when I met him. But I wanted to jokingly tell him that Waterworld was my favorite. 

Ray Shell: [00:18:58] Yeah. 

Camille Johnson: [00:18:59] And the executive producer chuckled when I told him that he’s like, he loves it when people say that. But I have always wanted gills behind my ears. I’m not going to lie. 

Hal Johnson: [00:19:09] Yeah, that wouldn’t be a bad thing. 

Camille Johnson: [00:19:09] That would have been fun. 

Hal Johnson: [00:19:10] I just wonder how much sincerity you could have mustered when you told him that. I don’t know. 

Camille Johnson: [00:19:15] I actually was a little starstruck. I don’t feel like I’m normally, I don’t really care about seeing stars, but, I got to go to a lunch with him and a bunch of the crew and producers and I wasn’t even going to ask him for a photo. I just didn’t want to bother him, I guess. And then one of our commissioners was like, hey, do you want to get a photo with Kevin? And I was like if it’s not a bother and he’s like, sure. So then we stand up to get a photo and I turned into Cheshire cat, like my grin was so wide and my cheeks were up here in my eyes shut and it’s like the ugliest photo of me, but you can’t not post it. So, yeah, there’s Kevin Costner and a Cheshire cat somewhere on Facebook. That’s funny. 

Ray Shell: [00:19:54] Speaking of the indigenous people, there’s actually a movie that was filmed here in 2020. So it was my first experience in the film industry and I went on to be a production assistant and COVID shut them down twice. And I know it premiered in July and originally was called Burn Rider. Then I went to Alta Valley and now it’s called The Stolen Valley because it was actually bought. So it’s called the Stolen Valley. It should be we’re hoping to bring it here to show it here because if you watch — 

Camille Johnson: [00:20:26] The Film Fest or just in the Kanab? Okay, I’m getting ahead of myself. 

Hal Johnson: [00:20:31] She’s got her fingers crossed. 

Camille Johnson: [00:20:32] Just buzz that one out. 

Ray Shell: [00:20:35] Hopefully it makes it to Film Fest because I am involved with Kanab Film Festival also. But it’s a very good movie. But when you watch it, like I sent you the little trailer for it, it shows you’ll watch it and you’ll be like, oh, I know that place. There’s the Buckskin Tavern. Oh, there’s where it’s now called Nomad Cafe. And then, like, oh, there’s Johnson Canyon. But how they end up at Straws and now they’re over there. Like, but it’s a pretty good movie and it’s about the struggle of a — 

Camille Johnson: [00:21:01] Female Bronc rider. Right? 

Ray Shell: [00:21:03] Yeah, female Bronc rider who’s like she can get anything she wants by powering through. But a young woman is trying to look, get money for her sick mom. And so she goes to check on this land that was originally her mom’s and then she’s trying to fight back for it. And it’s a thriller. It’s good. It’s based in the ’90s, but it’s a really good heartfelt movie and we did so well and my horses are in it. They got to be stars — 

Camille Johnson: [00:21:35] We need to get a Hoove print from them. 

Ray Shell: [00:21:37] Yeah, like stars. 

Hal Johnson: [00:21:39] Ray Shell, nine horses nine, make some screen time? 

Ray Shell: [00:21:43] Not all nine horses, but the one that did make the most screen time he came back from filming and he pretty much was like, I’m a movie star now. You must obey me. And he kind of still has that personality. We’ve done some events for like an elopement where they needed horses they wanted to ride and then take pictures. They want to ride up to the Cave Lakes. They wanted to ride up to the meadow to take pictures. And the photographer, like does he like the camera? And I was like, oh yeah. He knows when the cameras roll and he was like, oh, get my good side. 

Camille Johnson: [00:22:17] So cute. 

Hal Johnson: [00:22:17] Wow. 

Camille Johnson: [00:22:19] Well, Rochelle had mentioned, Ray Shell, sorry, Kevin, sorry, Uncle Kev. She had mentioned that you had done 10 productions in the last year. Can you mention a couple of highlights from that?

Ray Shell: [00:22:33] Yeah, so we were so busy last year. Worked on like Can Am, Can Am commercial actually got to be props on that one instead of a production assistant. So it’s a different side of it. We did Polaris and then, let me think. I was a security guard for Horizon for Kevin. 

Camille Johnson: [00:22:52] Oh, nice. 

Ray Shell: [00:22:55] And then gosh, I had a list. 

Hal Johnson: [00:22:58] She put you on spot. You put her on the spot big time. 

Ray Shell: [00:22:59] It’s a big list because I mean, we did a commercial for Honey’s. 

Camille Johnson: [00:23:03] A grocery store so we might have to cut this. But can you talk were you involved with Alicia Keys’s music video? 

Ray Shell: [00:23:11] Yes. Yes. 

Camille Johnson: [00:23:12] Can I say that? I don’t know if I can say that I’m not under a D&D so.

Ray Shell: [00:23:15] I can say it. I think they already released some of it. I was actually for, hopefully, I say it right. It’s Lang Lang. I think that’s how they say his name. He’s a pianist. So they did like a – both of them together. And I was his like personal assistant basically made sure he had food and made sure he had water. I carried water around and an umbrella and then it was windy the one day and I was like, I’m going to Marry Poppins off this plateau. 

Camille Johnson: [00:23:46] That’s awesome. I think it’s just really cool how we have so many cool productions going on here and plus something that I think is really interesting and maybe weird to some people is how many celebrities that we have in Kane County between Amangiri Resort that is where a lot of stars and very wealthy people stay. And then the film production and then also Best Friends Animal Sanctuary is the largest No Kill Animal Sanctuary in North America. And there’s a lot of celebrities who like to donate to that. 

So it’s not unusual to have like a Learjet warming up in the runway. Kind of a funny story, we could see we could hear the Learjet on for quite a while and Carl’s like, oh, Kevin Costner must be in town and I knew it was Alicia Keys. And so when they took off, like bye Alicia. 

Hal Johnson: [00:24:32] Did you get to meet Alicia when she was here? 

Ray Shell: [00:24:34] I tried to really operate professional capacity in that. So I probably said a few words to her but I didn’t like, introduce myself or something. She was pretty focused and she has like an entourage. So like, someone gives her a pedicure, manicure, makeup, hair, clothing, like, and it’s all her personal people. So like, she doesn’t like the production, doesn’t bring it in.

Camille Johnson: [00:25:00] When I hear things like that, I do want to be rich. 

Hal Johnson: [00:25:04] Well, I’m just wondering, I mean, who got the better treatment? Alicia Keys or your horse who became a prima donna after that one treatment, right? 

Ray Shell: [00:25:13] Yeah. 

Camille Johnson: [00:25:14] Hi, Alicia, I’d like you to meet my horse. 

Ray Shell: [00:25:17] But what was really cool on set, she’s really cool and very friendly. Very, just nice to everybody and like making jokes. 

Hal Johnson: [00:25:25] Yeah. 

Camille Johnson: [00:25:25] She seems like just kind of America’s sweetheart down to earth and very. 

Hal Johnson: [00:25:32] Very approachable, very nice. 

Camille Johnson: [00:25:33] Even kind of innocent looking. So I’m wondering, could we have you just dive in, you’ve got kind of another topic that you can talk to us about. Is that okay, Katie? Okay. Geeking out on Dinosaurs, right? 

Hal Johnson: [00:25:44] Switching gears a little bit. 

Camille Johnson: [00:25:46] Yeah. Yeah, that was our 9th episode of the season and you’ve got some cool fun facts and information there. So do spill. 

Ray Shell: [00:25:54] Yeah, that’s another thing I got to work on last year was Nat Geo. We did an episode of during the oceans. It’s not out yet, but I’m pretty sure this like out with everybody. So I even got to be a student paleontologist because we need an extra. So I will be in that episode hopefully. I got my BLM-like outfit on and I wear my cowboy hat and cowboy boots. 

Hal Johnson: [00:26:19] Is it a cutaway shot, three-quarters cutaway, or do you have full camera? 

Camille Johnson: [00:26:23] Depends on what ends up getting edited, right? 

Ray Shell: [00:26:25] We actually went out with Dr. Alan Titus and we went to the dig site out in Escalone where they found 4 T-rex imprints buried the whole things and they were all buried together and it kind of challenged them like, why is there 4 T-rex buried in one spot? They were known as being a lone hunters, being alone, not herds, not families. So they’re trying to discover why were they all 4 together in one spot? 

Camille Johnson: [00:26:54] That’s right. I remember him talking about this that they hunt like a wolf pack and packs and that’s wild to think of that. 

Hal Johnson: [00:26:59] Interesting. 

Camille Johnson: [00:26:59] Imagine four of those suckers coming at you. 

Hal Johnson: [00:27:03] Is that kind of what they thought Ray Shell? Did they kind of think that they’re a pack hunting and something happened to him? 

Ray Shell: [00:27:08] Yeah, because, and I even got to print out like what the actual area looked like back way back then. So like we were basically in water, this would have been an ocean. So like where they were at is kind of like he said a big event happened and that’s where it happened at. And it’s so funny because you walk around with him and he’s able, he pointed out like turtle shells and oh, that’s a bone. And I’m like, that looks like petrified wood. 

Camille Johnson: [00:27:33] So it’s hard to spot. You have to have almost an eye for it.

Ray Shell: [00:27:35] And to know you actually pick it up and you lick it and if your tongue sticks to the dinosaur bone, it’s the bone. 

Hal Johnson: [00:27:42] You’re kidding me? Really? 

Ray Shell: [00:27:43] Yeah. And he’s like, just lick it. How many people have looked that bone?

Camille Johnson: [00:27:47] I kind of feel like he was hazing you. 

Ray Shell: [00:27:49] No, he actually licked it and he’s like, look, see, see?

Hal Johnson: [00:27:53] Interesting. 

Ray Shell: [00:27:54] I will take your word for it. 

Hal Johnson: [00:27:55] Yeah. You were just mentioning a little bit off the air that Dr. Alan Titus has a tie-in of sorts to Jurassic Park. What is that? Tell us about it. 

Ray Shell: [00:28:03] Yes. I just I learned that this weekend at Linz and Tunes because his band played, Mesozoic played this weekend and from Canal Filmfest. Jeff from Kanab Filmfest made a post about a fact saying Dr. Alan Grant was named after Dr. Alan Titus. And I was like, what? You’re kidding me. That makes sense because he’s world-renowned. 

Hal Johnson: [00:28:25] That’s who he is. I can say that patterned after him, right? That’s so cool. 

Camille Johnson: [00:28:32] And he is really an interesting, cool character too Dr. Titus. Yeah, he plays in a band. So he does that locally. He has gigs and gigs and digs. That’s what I say about Dr. Titus. So, he’s just a cool character. And we’re lucky to have him here. 

Hal Johnson: [00:28:47] I’ll say, did you coin that, by the way? Gigs and digs? 

Camille Johnson: [00:28:47] I did. At least I think I did. He liked it when I first debuted it to him years ago. He chuckled over it. 

Hal Johnson: [00:28:54] Yeah. Well, like I said, I was jealous after I heard that when I’m like, dang it, I couldn’t have done that interview. So fun. 

Camille Johnson: [00:28:59] Yeah. 

Hal Johnson: [00:29:01] Yeah, no, right? Ray Shell, thanks so much for coming and discussing these things, movies and dinosaurs and fascinating stuff. 

Ray Shell: [00:29:10] Yeah, thank you. 

Camille Johnson: [00:29:10] Thank you talk to you later. 

Hal Johnson: [00:29:12] Take care. Talk to you soon. Big round of applause in the background. Love it. Okay. So our fourth episode was Fierce Women, Polygamy Power and an evasive saloon. So where you’ve had Emily in on that interview, invited her back. She’s taking a seat right now. Put the headphones on. 

Camille Johnson: [00:29:30] She’s always got fun stories. Fun facts. 

Hal Johnson: [00:29:31] I’ll say, remind me of your title. You’re over the Museums or History. 

Emily Bentley: [00:29:35] Yeah, I worked for the City of Kanab. So we have to municipal museums. We have the Historic Heritage House Museum. And then we have the Kanab Museum. 

Hal Johnson: [00:29:42] Right. Right. And so you covered a lot of stuff that time. That was fascinating though. So I think we talked about the all-City Town Council, all women will get it out. One of these times. 

Emily Bentley: [00:29:52] All women because it’s what women can do. 

Hal Johnson: [00:29:54] That’s what I was trying to say. 

Camille Johnson: [00:29:56] A little respect, please. 

Hal Johnson: [00:29:58] I’m sorry Yeah. no kidding. Right. That was like 1911, I think. Right? 

Emily Bentley: [00:30:02] Yes. They were elected in 1911 but they didn’t take office till 1912. But one of the earliest, all-female elected governments in the country, the earliest, all-women town council in Utah. It’s just it’s something really unique to Kanab. It’s something that we’re really proud of. 

Camille Johnson: [00:30:17] And I have a picture of the All Women Town council in my office. Yeah, I think it’s like such an inspiration that they tackled such big issues and did a great job before women could even vote in the US. 

Emily Bentley: [00:30:29] Yeah, absolutely. And one of the things too that I always like to talk about is we kind of talked about them as the all-women town council, but they were even so much more than that. Right. One of them was a nurse, one was raising children of her husband who had recently lost their mother. So these were busy, active women in the community already who then also stepped up and took on this role. And I just think, “No wonder you have the picture.” There’s something so inspirational about that. 

Hal Johnson: [00:30:56] And they didn’t waltz through it. They were very active, very busy legislatively and getting things done and initiatives that is carried over to this day. Some of them. 

Emily Bentley: [00:31:04] Yeah. Absolutely. It’s funny, some of their earliest things, like, one of the earliest ordinances they passed had to do with kind of putting restrictions on door-to-door salesman as it were because they wanted to support — you know, but it’s because they wanted to support local business. They realized that that was where their priorities were. One of the kind of obscure things I think about is they had the cemetery plotted. That’s something that’s still part of our community today. So they definitely changed things. 

Camille Johnson: [00:31:31] They thought ahead and they were planning and they were active.

Emily Bentley: [00:31:33] Yeah, absolutely. 

Hal Johnson: [00:31:34] And I remember there was a story about the events under which they ran. It was kind of kind of considered a joke, right? Or the men were teasing them into it. What was that about? 

Emily Bentley: [00:31:43] You know, it’s one of those things where one of my favorite lines is, I don’t really like to call it a joke because a joke has a punch line. But there was nothing funny about this. It was a prank though. Some men in town put their names on the ballot. The women had no idea until I think it was Mary Chamberlain who was the one that would be essentially the mayor, the president of the town board. I think it was her dad who came in and told her, like, guess what happened? This is on you and there was some debate among the women, but ultimately, as I brought out earlier, they stepped up. 

Camille Johnson: [00:32:16] So amazing. I can’t even imagine the climate back then to do that. 

Hal Johnson: [00:32:20] Right. And I can’t remember it was Camille or you were Emily, we’re talking about the five-page ordinance about alcohol restriction or trying to get clean up the town that way. Right. 

Camille Johnson: [00:32:29] That was Emily. 

Hal Johnson: [00:32:30] Emily, tell us more about the ordinance. 

Emily Bentley: [00:32:32] Yeah, I was just going to say, yeah, you know, it was the evils of alcohol. So this is something that they were dead set against. But again, it just speaks to, they were really trying to prioritize the community. They were looking out for the safety of their family for what they could do to help the community to be stronger and to thrive and last longer. 

Camille Johnson: [00:32:50] Well, that was really a big deal back then I think, and maybe the Christian world that they were really kind of fighting against alcohol. I can’t think of that word.

Emily Bentley: [00:32:58] Prohibition. 

Camille Johnson: [00:33:00] No, no, it was like — 

Hal Johnson: [00:33:01] Temperance. 

Camille Johnson: [00:33:02] Temperance. You see that from a lot of publications around that time period. So, I think that was just kind of a hot topic. 

Emily Bentley: [00:33:08] Yeah, absolutely. When you look on what was going on even on a national level for sure. But then I do think Camille had talked a little bit about the roll-away saloon because one of the things about Kanab is our unique proximity to the Arizona border so that was definitely going to going to cause a little bit of friction there because like we talked about how they were elected in 1911, took office in 1912. Arizona doesn’t even become a state until 1912. So when they’re elected into office, Utah is already a state, Arizona is still a territory. So the way they’re kind of governed the laws that we’re going to apply to them, we’re going to be vastly different. So they literally had this in their own backyard. 

Hal Johnson: [00:33:43] Isn’t that something? And so when you say roll away a saloon or evasive saloon, how did that work Camille? 

Camille Johnson: [00:33:47] You know what? We already kind of talked about that, but really, it was just evading the law. So when they saw the law coming from Kane County or Utah, they had this loon on logs and they could roll it across into the Arizona territory to escape them and then they could roll it back. So it was a mobile saloon. 

Emily Bentley: [00:34:06] And you know what, I’ll just have to say this. One of my deep dark secrets is even though I do work for the city of Kanab, I do live in Arizona and that’s still how we do stuff down there. We’re still a little edgy over in Arizona.

Camille Johnson: [00:34:19] I love it. 

Hal Johnson: [00:34:21] You fit right in. 

Camille Johnson: [00:34:21] She’s got the sass. Is there anything that you want to announce update-wise or any cool exhibits or anything? 

Emily Bentley: [00:34:28] Yeah, thanks for giving me the opportunity. So, one of the things we’ve talked about is doing the renovation on our historic building that holds the museum that’s coming along. We’re still shooting at being open in the spring. But May is Archaeology and Preservation Month. So we’re working with some local archaeologists and paleontologists and some other people. We’re going to have some really great historic programming in May, some preservation programming too. So I just encourage everybody to follow our social media on Facebook and Instagram for Kanab Museum and see what we’re up to because we’re always going to be up to something. 

Camille Johnson: [00:34:58] That’s awesome. Is that the best places, social media or is there a website as well?

Emily Bentley: [00:35:01] Yes, so we’re but social media is also great. Yeah, wherever people can find us, we’re there, we’ll take it any way we can get. 

Camille Johnson: [00:35:09] Emily does such a good job. I’m just so proud of her. She has taken this on with extreme ownership and makes it fun. I love watching your posts. 

Hal Johnson: [00:35:15] And keeps it fresh for what, seven years now or something Emily? 

Emily Bentley: [00:35:18] Yeah. So I’ve worked for the city for about five years. My current role for just a couple of years. But yeah, I moved here about 7, 8 years ago and I just want to speak to thank you so much for doing this for setting up the podcast. You know, I wanted to say something about the Magic of Kanab when I was listening to all the people that came up before me. I mean, it’s true. The fact that we’re so well connected. We have so many interesting stories, so many amazing people like that’s the Magic of Kanab. And this podcast is really a great way to highlight it. So, thank you too for doing this. 

Camille Johnson: [00:35:47] It’s been a lot of fun. We need to have her on here more. 

Hal Johnson: [00:35:51] I was just going to say. Guest podcaster or maybe — 

Camille Johnson: [00:35:54] Most is with the most is, I don’t know. When Hal bogs out and quits on us. 

Emily Bentley: [00:35:59] Oh, that’ll never happen. I’ve been over-talking to his wife who’s just lovely. She’s going to keep him going for years. I can tell she’s got some life in her. 

Camille Johnson: [00:36:04] I know I’m just going to, I’m going to be humble here. So the peeking-out and dinosaurs wasn’t the best performing of the podcast. And I’m like, they hate me. They love Hal. 

Hal Johnson: [00:36:15] Oh you, don’t listen to that. 

Emily Bentley: [00:36:17] We love on behalf of Kanab in Kane County. We love you both. 

Hal Johnson: [00:36:20] So nice. My goodness. 

Camille Johnson: [00:36:22] Thank you. Just a little. 

Hal Johnson: [00:36:24] She is like a trained master of ceremonies. I mean, she is so good at what she does. Yes. But a great advocate for our city and her mom’s here visiting so, way to knock it out of the park when your mom’s watching. 

Emily Bentley: [00:36:35] Yeah. Right. Well, you know, we can’t go anywhere without our fan club. You have your wife. I have my mom. 

Hal Johnson: [00:36:39] That’s right. That’s right. 

Camille Johnson: [00:36:41] I have my husband back there in the cap. 

Emily Bentley: [00:36:42] Oh yeah, I see him back there. 

Hal Johnson: [00:36:43] Low profile Carl back there. Yeah. 

Emily Bentley: [00:36:46] But again, that’s what makes this kind of stuff special. 

Hal Johnson: [00:36:49] That’s right. 

Camille Johnson: [00:36:51] Thank you so much, Emily. 

Emily Bentley: [00:36:51] Thanks for having me. 

Hal Johnson: [00:36:51] Goodness. Thanks, round of applause. I love it. 

Camille Johnson: [00:36:57] Next up, we have Jeanette, we are going to have Jeanette talk with us a little bit about East of Zion. So Zion is somewhere third or fourth most visited National Park in the United States. A lot of volume of visitors to the park, but we have kind of a cool little secret with the east side of Zion. And I know one of Jeanette’s favorite hikes is over there. So Jeanette, first of all, tell us who you are and we’ll dive into East of Zion. 

Jeanette Peatross: [00:37:28] All right. Well, thank you, Camille. Thanks for having me. My name’s Jeanette Peatross and I worked for the Office of Tourism in Kanab and I was born in Kanab and I grew up here, spent a lot of my time in Zion. And so I’m really excited to be able to talk about that today. 

Camille Johnson: [00:37:42] Well, and Jeanette is kind of like the heiress of tourism since her father is Dennis Judd and he was the pioneer of tourism. So it’s in her DNA. 

Jeanette Peatross: [00:37:52] That’s right. And he was in episode 3, of this podcast. 

Hal Johnson: [00:37:55] He was so fun. He was so funny. I had so many great stories seriously. It was kind of fun because he would close his eyes as he’s reminiscing back on these decades-old stories and just you could just see it. Yeah, just pulling the vision out of his memory banks. It was fun to watch. It’s so entertaining.

Camille Johnson: [00:38:10] And you could see the emotions attached with the stories too because he was like, you could see like the smile on his face, the emotions that he felt taking him back in time. But anyway, he’s done amazing things for this community. And now the next generation is working in tourism as well. Oh, go ahead. 

Hal Johnson: [00:38:28] Sorry. Favorite hike. One of your favorite hikes is there. Tell us about it.

Jeanette Peatross: [00:38:31] Yes. My favorite hike in Zion on the east side especially is Observation Point. I just love it because you drive up to a place called Zion Ponderosa, you enter there and you drive down this dirt road and then you get to the trailhead and then you follow this trail along and you end up overlooking all of Zion. It’s really kind of like a backdoor entry into the park because you don’t have to go down into the park entrance and then hike your way up. It’s kind of more of a lower elevation gain hike. So, yeah, you go from Zion Ponderosa and it’s incredible. The overlook there is mind-boggling. 

Hal Johnson: [00:39:09] I’ve heard so many good things. I have not been there. So, how long have a hike is it? How long are you on foot? 

Jeanette Peatross: [00:39:14] I would say you could probably two hours would be if I thought about four miles. That makes sense. It’s a good hike. But again, because you aren’t doing that severe elevation gain that you do when you hike from the bottom up, it’s not hard. 

Hal Johnson: [00:39:26] Is this one you can take children with you on? It’s not a problem? 

Jeanette Peatross: [00:39:29] Yes. I even took my dog. 

Hal Johnson: [00:39:31] Wow. 

Camille Johnson: [00:39:33] I also like Jeanette, I love Observation Point. It’s just such a beautiful hike. I was actually, we’re talking about it. I was just picturing sitting out there on this rock looking at the overlook there, eating lunch, it’s just peppered with a few visitors. It’s not really a high-volume hike, at least in my experience when I’ve been there, but I also tend to hike in the shoulder season. At first, I was kind of like, am I making this up? But your app tracks your steps and so when I looked at them by month, I’m more active November through April. 

I just kind of like it when there’s fewer visitors in the area that you can go out and enjoy it. Plus the temperatures in the summer can get pretty high by 1 PM and I’m not a morning person so I can hike in the winder, sleep in a little bit, but I have more hikable daylight hours for me. 

Hal Johnson: [00:40:22] It’s great. You can confuse me for a minute. I could have sworn you said shoulder season. What is that? 

Camille Johnson: [00:40:28] Yes. Shoulder season. So, on the shoulder of our busy season. 

Hal Johnson: [00:40:31] Oh you do say shoulder. 

Camille Johnson: [00:40:33] Yeah, we do call it the shoulder. 

Hal Johnson: [00:40:35] I thought you were actually trying to say colder season. I get it now. 

Camille Johnson: [00:40:37] No. Yeah. It’s an industry term. I shouldn’t have thrown that out there. I could start just speaking in alphabet soup if I start to do the industry lingo. 

Hal Johnson: [00:40:44] Right. Right. Well, what else can Camille do? 

Camille Johnson: [00:40:46] I just, I think that’s great. It’s super fun if you haven’t been, make sure that you book a stay in Kanab either the east side of the park or Zion Mountain Ranch, Zion Ponderosa. There’s a cute community Order Ville as well as a lot of cool experiential lodging there. Then the great hikes that are on the east side of the park and even when you’re outside the boundaries of the park, you have a Zion-like experience, you don’t even know you’re outside the boundaries of the park. So don’t underestimate the peripheral area of the National Park. 

Hal Johnson: [00:41:17] That’s great. Spoken like a true tourism professional way to go. 

Camille Johnson: [00:41:21] Thank you. I have my moments. 

Hal Johnson: [00:41:22] She got those plugs in very nicely. 

Camille Johnson: [00:41:25] Awesome. Thank you so much, Jeanette. Appreciate it. 

Jeanette Peatross: [00:41:27] Yeah. Thank you for having me. 

Hal Johnson: [00:41:29] Alright. Round of applause. I love it. Okay. So we’re going to talk about our next segment, which was actually we’re going to go to episode 7. It was Our 2 Million-Acres Secret: The Grand Staircase, Escalante National Monument. 

Camille Johnson: [00:41:46] Trevor Lee coming up. 

Hal Johnson: [00:41:48] Yes, we originally talked with Bob Riding and also Dr. Alan Titus a little bit, but Trevor Lee is a tour guide extraordinaire and knows the area extremely well. So we’re happy to have him here today. 

Camille Johnson: [00:41:58] Welcome, Trevor. He’s getting his earphones on and joining us now. 

Trevor Lee: [00:42:02] Thanks so much. Glad to be here. 

Camille Johnson: [00:42:03] So you and I were talking over here in the side area about one of the really cool places that you can go in the monument. You want to tell folks what that is? 

Trevor Lee: [00:42:14] Well, I think there’s a lot of cool places that you can go in the monument. Some of the local destinations just outside of Kanab here. I mean the Great Chamber is a wonderful space, super cool feature, probably the largest alcove I’ve ever seen outside of the Grand Canyon. So that’s always something that people really enjoy. 

Camille Johnson: [00:42:33] Well, and that, so we talked about this a little bit, I think before that was on when they debuted the iPhone with the three lenses. So it was on their demo, photo library and demo video library. And I remember just like I was had such a proud moment seeing that on there. 

Hal Johnson: [00:42:49] Yeah, of all the places in the world they could have chosen to include in that selection. Yes. 

Camille Johnson: [00:42:53] That and Peekaboo. But you do tours out to the Great Chamber, right, Trevor? 

Trevor Lee: [00:42:58] We do, we run tours to the Great Chamber. We take people out to sea into a march. Sometimes we’ll go to the top of the Vermillion Cliffs there to Flagpoint. You just have a lot of great features and formations out on the monument in Bull Valley Gorge. Super cool that Slot Canyon always delivers strong for people. So I think all those are good recommendations. 

Camille Johnson: [00:43:18] Hal and I did that a year ago, January. It was winter, there is snow and ice. 

Hal Johnson: [00:43:25] It was so cold. Oh my goodness. It was beautiful. But that particular day was like, probably the coldest of the year. And I swear that time you’re in the Gorge, it was dropped to 10 degrees probably. I mean, it was worth it, but it was like, it was a cold one. 

Camille Johnson: [00:43:39] I’m a typical Utah-n and I’m a diet Coke junkie. We love our soda here. And so I had a Diet Coke in the pocket of my coat. It was plenty cold when I cracked it open in Bull Valley Gorge. 

Hal Johnson: [00:43:51] Surprised it wasn’t a slushy. Right? 

Camille Johnson: [00:43:52] Yeah, exactly. I wouldn’t have minded that. What other things do you recommend in the Grand Staircase? 

Trevor Lee: [00:43:58] Well, I think that the Cottonwood Canyon Road has a lot to offer. You’ve got that lower hackberry Yellow Top. I think these are lesser-known destinations in the monument. But I think they’re all super strong destinations. 

Camille Johnson: [00:44:10] And these are all places that you guide to? 

Trevor Lee: [00:44:13] Not all of them. Some of those are options that people can do on their own. What we do is mostly centered here around Kanab. But you also have a lot of great access for the monument from like Escalante. We don’t guide that far away, although there’s certainly companies that do. But you’ve got that hole in the rock road outside Escalante that goes into the monument. It has Spooky and Peekaboo, Zebra. These are all super, super great Slot Canyons. 

Camille Johnson: [00:44:38] I did spooky for the first time in the last year and it’s intense. It’s very narrow in parts that I was a little surprised. There was a couple of hikers that were ahead of us that had kind of a panic attack from the claustrophobia. So I learned how good I am at stemming, climbing up the walls to let her go underneath and then her partner followed and had to kind of go the opposite direction. She just kind of had a panic attack. So it’s very small spaces. Hal is a big beefy guy, a very muscular guy, but he would not fit in Spooky. I don’t recommend it for you. 

Hal Johnson: [00:45:16] I appreciate the clarification. I’m not sure I agree with it. 

Camille Johnson: [00:45:19] He’s my brother. I can say these things. 

Hal Johnson: [00:45:22] Yeah, Shauna, my wife, right? 

Camille Johnson: [00:45:24] Is he beefy? Super busy, she said. 

Hal Johnson: [00:45:28] No. So I’m curious, I mean, you were tight. You’re a little claustrophobic in there and you couldn’t back out for whatever reason. So it was — 

Camille Johnson: [00:45:35] You can, but you’re just kind of going, it’s a one-way canyon it’s supposed to be. But sometimes people don’t get the memo and it causes some congestion and, but, yeah, it’s a very tight space. If you’re going to do it, one of the things that I thought is have one of those smaller packs just basically carry your water. Keep it pretty minimal because people were kind of struggling with their backpacks in Spooky. 

Trevor Lee: [00:45:59] Yeah, I know when I’ve been through there, I actually take my backpack off and just hold it in front of me as I, I’m not a giant but I rub front and back in some of those. So, it’s pretty tight. 

Camille Johnson: [00:46:08] Yeah, it’s a beautiful canyon, beautiful experience though. 

Hal Johnson: [00:46:11] Nice. Trevor, this kind of put you on the spot a little bit. But if you had to pick one, I’d like to take people out. You go, that’s the one I want to take people out to. Is there one that kind of stands out in your mind? 

Trevor Lee: [00:46:21] Not so much. I mean, I think the Great Chamber is an awesome space, right? I mean, it over-delivers for everybody that you take there. So, the monuments here, I mean, the Grand Staircase also the Vermilion Cliffs National Monument and the Glen Canyon Rec area. I mean, these all have, these are world-class landscapes. So there’s a lot there to explore that I don’t think people really appreciate because it’s maybe not a national park or it’s not better known. But, these destinations, they always deliver. 

Camille Johnson: [00:46:46] Well, one of the comments that I continue to hear from visitors is basically everything around us could be a national park. It’s national park-esque quality hiking here. 

Hal Johnson: [00:46:59] Yeah. Yeah, I get the chance to take people out as well on tours and, oh, my goodness, they are just rubbernecking left and right and exclaiming and like, ah, of all the visual feast that they’re looking at so much. And I agree with you, Trevor on Great Chamber. That is an amazing place. So cool. 

Camille Johnson: [00:47:11] I heard somebody used the word one time that it has stuck with me that in Utah, you’re gobsmacked. It’s just kind of constantly in this wonder of, like, disbelief. Is this real? And I still feel that way. I live here and the lighting changes, the seasons change. And I’m just in awe. You’d think as tourism director, I would be like, oh, I got all the photos I can handle. I’m like the worst offender with taking photos. It’s just, it’s so beautiful. 

Trevor Lee: [00:47:41] Yeah, I think that’s why some of us live here. 

Camille Johnson: [00:47:43] Yeah. That’s right. Good quality of life too. But, hey, do we want to recruit people here or not? Let’s bleep out that part. 

Hal Johnson: [00:47:50] It’s okay. It’s okay. 

Camille Johnson: [00:47:53] It’s okay. We don’t want to keep you from it. But it’s kind of been a nice little well-kept secret as far as quality of life. 

Hal Johnson: [00:48:00] That’s right. That’s right. Come and enjoy and then go see some other really cool things. 

Camille Johnson: [00:48:04] Yeah. Yeah. Move along. Awesome. 

Hal Johnson: [00:48:06] Trevor, are we’re leaving anything out? Anything else you’d like to add? 

Trevor Lee: [00:48:09] I don’t think so. I really appreciate you having me on. 

Camille Johnson: [00:48:11] Thanks, Trevor. 

Hal Johnson: [00:48:11] It’s been awesome. Thank you. Thank you so much. That round of applause well deserved. 

Camille Johnson: [00:48:17] Absolutely. Trevor’s a tour guide extraordinaire. 

Hal Johnson: [00:48:20] Yes, my goodness. And people skills. Holy cow. Alright. 

Camille Johnson: [00:48:24] Hal, before we move on, I was going to ask you about that because you do plenty of tours. What’s your favorite? 

Hal Johnson: [00:48:31] Oh, man. I’m kind of like Trevor. That is like a tough one. We mainly do about half a dozen destinations and I like taking people out for more than just a couple hours if we can do two or three or four stops like — yeah. Great Chamber and then maybe the Hoodoos and then Peekaboo Slot Canyon, Southwark or just whatever we’re doing. If they get a spin, say 4, 5, 6 hours, the machines are blessed. There is so much fun. So we’ll have people who, oh, I’ll drive, but I’m going to go slow and I’ll say sure that’s fine. Famous last words though. And a mile down the road, a mile down the road there, giggling as they’re cruising down through those roads. And so it’s so fun to get to share it. I feel like I’m honestly paid to play. It’s not work.

Camille Johnson: [00:49:15] Oh you are paid to play. It’s a good gig. 

Hal Johnson: [00:49:17] I can’t call is work. 

Camille Johnson: [00:49:17] We have a lot of great guiding outfitter companies around here and it seems like the best job ever. 

Hal Johnson: [00:49:24] Yeah, it is. It really is. 

Camille Johnson: [00:49:25] Well, I was going to say about Grand Staircase. So we live in the middle of Zion Canyon, Zion National Park, Bryce Canyon National Park, Grand Canyon National Park, North Rim and then Lake Powell and the Glen Canyon Recreation Area. And people are always like, what’s your favorite? And it’s, I always say the Grand Staircase, I mean, it’s two million acres. So you’re not narrowing it down a lot. But I do feel like an explorer out there and it is national park quality and I haven’t dropped my jaw literally. But I think twice in my life and Cottonwood Road was one of them when we came up over the hill and the lighting. And I was like, oh, it was just gasp-worthy, so much beauty there. 

Hal Johnson: [00:50:07] It really is. 

Camille Johnson: [00:50:08] One of the things that didn’t come up. I thought it would with Trevor or maybe you were Willis Creek Slot Canyon. I went there in the winter also and it normally has flowing water through it, but it was frozen. So you got the Slot Canyon and then this frozen floor and it was just like a winter wonderland. 

Hal Johnson: [00:50:26] Yeah. Well, just a week ago, a Peekaboo Slot canyon I’ve taken some people through there and there is gigantic icicles hanging off the upper cliff. I mean massive and dripping water down because it started to, got above freezing. It was like a little rainfall down through there. And these massive root beer float-colored icicles with the sandy mud in them. And it was incredible. It was a winter wonderland. It was incredible. 

Camille Johnson: [00:50:50] Well, I know this isn’t in the monument but it just kind of like reviving these memories. Like I said, I love to hike in basically the off-season. So in Zion National Park, the Narrows is one of the top hikes that there’s often a lot of crowds in there, but I go in the winter and you rent a dry suit and you’ve got the poles and I recommend a helmet because on a warm day the ice can melt but there’s this algae on the walls in the Canyon and it looks, it’s kind of frozen over and it looks like gold. I think that’s Montezuma’s treasure. You see, maybe it’s hidden in the walls of the Canyon. 

Hal Johnson: [00:51:26] Hidden in plain sight. Kind of depends on the lighting. 

Camille Johnson: [00:51:30] Yeah. It’s just, it’s incredibly magical and beautiful. I could go on all day. 

Hal Johnson: [00:51:34] I think we both could. Yes. Well, it’s been wonderful. So again, thanks to Trevor. And then I think we’re going to talk briefly with Torrey Cluett and he is the master of the Kanab Center here where we’re broadcasting from today. 

Camille Johnson: [00:51:47] Yes, he’s amazing. So we did episode 8 was the Unconventional Conventions and Torrey has done such a good job. He’s great at increasing our production value. So in Utah were one of nine convention centers in the state. It’s kind of unusual for a county of our size to actually get a convention space, but it was a lot of community collaboration working together and I won’t go into that entirely, but we may not be the biggest box but Torrey is definitely making us the coolest and most versatile box. 

So since our last recording or your last recording with Torrey he’s has some updates, some new equipment and he’s got some plans for the terrace and then he’s also got some fun things lined up for the year. 

Hal Johnson: [00:52:37] So we’ll just add real quick. I think we’re also on the track to becoming one of the more popular, right? With the more used. 

Camille Johnson: [00:52:41] Yes. Yes, people love it and the cool thing so I’ve been to a lot of conferences and conventions and the thing that I think is so cool about Kanab is we’re in this remote rural destination and so a lot of the value of actually going to conferences or conventions is the networking that you get. But if you’re in a big city, it’s like after hours when you could really be having those meaningful conversations, people scattered to the four winds in the city. But here they stayed together and they do more immersive activities and you get so much more value and connectivity out of booking here. 

Hal Johnson: [00:53:15] Yeah, they’ll take joint tours and go out and see the same thing because it’s such a high reputation, they’ve heard about it. And so instead of just scattering, like you said. A group will come together and go see one of these sites. 

Camille Johnson: [00:53:25] Yeah, I don’t know if you guys saw on YouTube, this is very random, but there is a video that’s hilarious called Nature RX. And if you guys haven’t seen it, look it up. It’s hilarious, but it’s really the medicinal value and benefits from being in nature. So I think also you have great professional content at a convention of a conference and then you go and have this immersive connective experience in nature. And so it just, it feels incredible. 

Hal Johnson: [00:53:52] Sounds hilarious. 

Camille Johnson: [00:53:54] It is hilarious. Oh my gosh, you got to watch it. 

Hal Johnson: [00:53:57] Sounds really good. So I didn’t even jump in. So you’re going to tell us about upcoming things, updates?

Torrey Cluett: [00:54:04] Yeah, so we’ve, you know, over the last 67 months, we’ve really taken a look at how do we increase what we can do here. We are a smaller venue with what we offer here. People can come and not just enjoy their conference here but walk right outside and we’ve got access to like three different trails, walking distance from the conference center itself. 

We’ve got so many, different tour companies that you can get along with, get on with and have your event and take a two-hour break out. And instead of sitting in a box for two hours, you can go head out and go right side by side in the pink coral sand dunes or go to one of our Slot Canyons which was within driving distance. So for a few of the things that we’re doing here, I’m in a full rebranding phase just trying to make the place as marketable as possible. We’re looking at doing logos, print material, websites, video. 

One of the cool things we just did, we had a company come out and did it. It’s called a Matter Port and it’s a 3D digital virtual walk-through that creates an entire dollhouse map on our website. So you can actually manipulate it, move it. Look it from each angle, see which rooms you’re renting. 

Hal Johnson: [00:55:14] As though you were walking through yourself. 

Torrey Cluett: [00:55:17] Absolutely. 

Camille Johnson: [00:55:17] It’s really cool. It makes it easier for event organizers to really scope out the space without coming down here initially, so they can see it. But eventually, they do usually come and check it out in person. 

Hal Johnson: [00:55:29] Awesome. 

Torrey Cluett: [00:55:30] And that particular technology actually has the ability to put in little, little knowledge points so it’ll tell us what type of audio-visual stuff we have access to. We can actually include videos and photos of different events that have been held in that same spot. So it kind of gives event planners an idea of what the space can actually be used for. 

Camille Johnson: [00:55:49] You can convert it and use it more creatively. 

Hal Johnson: [00:55:52] Well, it’s a beautiful venue. I mean, obviously, anybody that comes here it’s just it shines of its own self. The outside, the inside is so professional and up-to-date, beautiful exterior, and right at the end of the band on Main Street Kanab, which is gorgeous views. 

Camille Johnson: [00:56:05] It’s definitely stately. I think maybe we talked about this, I don’t remember on the initial recording but it emulates the original high school on the hill in Kanab. And so there’s kind of this nostalgic attachment to the building as well. Me, I have a little bit of PTSD when I come in the building because I spent a lot of time in what used to be the principal’s office. I come in here and twitch a little bit and like, I’m in trouble. 

But no, Torrey has done such an amazing job and he’s got his staff, Julie and Josh here as well tonight and they just do incredible work together. 

Torrey Cluett: [00:56:41] Yeah, I really can’t thank them enough. I mean, it’s a whole team effort. We even call in the troops from the Office of Tourism to help us out on some of our bigger events. So it really takes a village. 

Hal Johnson: [00:56:53] I’m not sure exactly where the principal’s office was because they rejiggered the building a little bit. Okay. So, Torrey’s office is across from that and I got to say that’s quite the entertainment center. I mean, that might be the most entertaining thing in the whole Kanab Center. He’s got four vintage machines, arcade machines. 

Camille Johnson: [00:57:13] Many video machines. 

Torrey Cluett: [00:57:17] I spent so much time at work. I might as well make a man cave there. Right?

Camille Johnson: [00:57:20] It’s really cool. Victoria and Julie and Josh definitely have fun with it. But they do, you can tell that they love their jobs and it just shows and everything they do. I’m kind of like if people could see a visual of the room, they’ve got the cocktail tables with the table skirts. Is that we call them? Then the up lighting that are different colors. So it’s just so fun to take what would normally be kind of a boring box and make it more lively and fun. 

Hal Johnson: [00:57:45] Yes, and so helpful and so professional in everything they do. 

Camille Johnson: [00:57:48] Truly. Well, Torrey, do you want to talk about anything upcoming? I know we’ve got a comedian coming here soon. 

Torrey Cluett: [00:57:55] Yeah. Actually, we just, we just got on with a production company out of promoter, out of Perkin that does a lot of the bookings for, Tuacahn and the circuit for Cedar City. They came up toward the venue and just booked their first event. So we have a comedian, Nick Hoff is going to be coming up on May 12th. He’s actually a comedian that’s up and coming. He’s toured with Jeff Foxworthy and Larry, the Cable Guy. He’s opened for them. So he’s got some really good momentum right now. So we’re really excited to have one of our first performances. 

Hal Johnson: [00:58:26] So cool. 

Camille Johnson: [00:58:26] Well and that’s kind of unusual to have that kind of a booking in a convention center. But they’ve seen what Torrey can do to convert the space to make it very comedy club-like. One of the things that we hosted last year, I’m always like, embarrassed to bring this up, but it’s midget wrestling is what it’s called. And I mean, it seems like it should be illegal but it was so cool what Torrey and the staff did to convert the space. They had the ring in the middle of the room, had the chairs on four sides. They had like an elevated catwalk with fog machines and the lighting. It was just so cool. I was kind of like embarrassed to go, but I had to go to see it. I was just blown away at what Torrey did with this. 

Hal Johnson: [00:59:09] And they’ve requested the venue right there an independent third-party group who does this. They travel around the country and look for venues to entertain people. And so it was their construct. 

Torrey Cluett: [00:59:21] They called us up there out of their production company out Oklahoma and they were doing a tour, they were hitting Cedar City and then they were on their way back down to Vegas and they wanted to see if there was a venue that could hold them and be able to accommodate them for their show. 

Camille Johnson: [00:59:33] And they were so great. They were just so personable too. They stayed after the show and visited with people and our other brother, one of our other brothers, he’s in law enforcement so he uses his smile sparingly. But we have a photo of him with a very large smile that day. 

Hal Johnson: [00:59:50] Well, I was, unfortunately, sick that day. I missed it. But my goodness, I guess it was really well attended, well received. So much fun. 

Torrey Cluett: [00:59:56] Hal, you didn’t miss it because they’re coming back on July 1st. 

Hal Johnson: [00:59:59] Are they coming back on July 1st?

Torrey Cluett: [01:00:00] They’re coming back. They booked us for 2023 and 2024. 

Hal Johnson: [01:00:01] Sign me up. I’m going to be taking Z-Paks a week in advance. I’ll make sure I don’t get sick. 

Camille Johnson: [01:00:06] Your vitamin C and lots of sleep. 

Hal Johnson: [01:00:08] Amen. That’s right. 

Camille Johnson: [01:00:10] Awesome. Well, thank you so much Torrey. Appreciate all the work you do that positively impacts the community and the visitor experience. 

Torrey Cluett: [01:00:18] We had a blast here. Come visit us. 

Camille Johnson: [01:00:19] Thank you. 

Hal Johnson: [01:00:23] Okay. Well, I’m trying to think Camille we talked about hikes quite a little bit, but I think we have one more person we wanted to talk to you real quick and let’s bring Megan over. Yeah, there she comes. 

Camille Johnson: [01:00:35] Megan. Megan. 

Hal Johnson: [01:00:36] She’s got a fresh perspective on hikes and some personal favorites. We’d love to hear from her. 

Camille Johnson: [01:00:40] Megan is over our Visitor Services and part of the tourism team. She runs the Visitor Center and supervises all the hosts there. So she has all the good brochures and information and our Visitor’s Center I would dare say is one of the top ones in the State of Utah. It’s just so well done. People have such a great experience there. I often get emails, calls, texts of people just saying how much they loved it and that they appreciated what a good well-run Visitor Center it is, so good job to Megan. 

Hal Johnson: [01:01:15] Yeah. Well, I have to add one thing. So I guess an observational level, Megan always smiles. Megan is always happy. 

Camille Johnson: [01:01:24] She’s got a great smile.

Hal Johnson: [01:01:24] Sometimes she can be stressed out and have a lot of things going and I don’t think I’ve ever seen her just without a pleasant face and smile. I don’t know how you do it. 

Megan: [01:01:33] I hope so because sometimes people look at my face and think —

Camille Johnson: [01:01:37] No, Megan is a delight to work with.

Megan: [01:01:39] She’s stressed. 

Hal Johnson: [01:01:40] You could coach on that. You could probably be a guru. 

Camille Johnson: [01:01:42] Yes. Have your smile-face when you’re not feeling it. Megan and I have had some weird parallels in life, like, I feel like Megan’s kind of my guardian angel. She moved here our freshman year. We’re in the same class graduating from Kanab high school. We won’t say which year. We don’t want people to know how old we are. Hopefully, our voices sound very young, but then Megan and I also ended up being roommates in college. We went to school at SUU and you just kind of sign up for housing. And all of a sudden, I’m like, “Oh, my gosh, Megan is my roommate.” 

Then, I ended up working for the tourism office Megan was already there. I don’t know if you remember this, Megan. This is kind of really weird where I think the good Lord above knows everything. And so really weird experience a friend of mine from Northern Utah wanted to send me this health drink. I don’t even remember the name of it, but she couldn’t reach me. And so she Googled my name, Visitor Center came up, I didn’t even work there. This was before I ever worked there. So she shifts it to the Visitor Center which I had not been in and Megan called me. She’s like, “Hey, there’s a package here for you.” And I’m like, what? 

So, yeah, I showed up and just kind of saw the Visitor Center for the first time. And I’m like, wow, she Googled the future. I now worked there nine years. And so do you remember that when I came? 

Megan: [01:03:08] I actually do. 

Camille Johnson: [01:03:10] That was wild. And then another side note, Hal and I – our father ran a gas station that was on that same lot when we were kids. And so I feel like it’s kind of my corner. 

Hal Johnson: [01:03:21] connections. Yeah. 

Camille Johnson: [01:03:23] 78 South 100 East. Hey Camille, that’s where you’re going to be on earth. 

Hal Johnson: [01:03:26] Yeah. So let’s just pause right now, Megan, what’s going to happen in 10 years? 

Camille Johnson: [01:03:30] Yeah, where am I going to be? What am I going to be doing? How is our life going to overlap? 

Megan: [01:03:35] I don’t know. I’d probably still be there. 

Camille Johnson: [01:03:36] Megan is definitely a constant. She’s been so awesome. So — 

Hal Johnson: [01:03:41] Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. So I got to, I just got to ask. Always smiling. Did she have an angsty period in high school or early college? 

Camille Johnson: [01:03:47] No. 

Hal Johnson: [01:03:48] Never? 

Camille Johnson: [01:03:49] No. Megan’s always just a pleasant person. 

Megan: [01:03:53] Thanks, Camille. 

Camille Johnson: [01:03:53] Yeah, I don’t know. I’ve never seen you throw a fit. 

Megan: [01:03:56] Maybe I did it behind your back. 

Camille Johnson: [01:03:59] That’s okay. That’s only appropriate. 

Hal Johnson: [01:04:03] I kind of got it. Anyway, Camille where are you going with this? 

Camille Johnson: [01:04:06] I was just kind of like I went off on a little bit of a tangent. But you know, I’m just in this mode of filling a lot of gratitude for all things with the Kane County Office of Tourism. I’ve been able to work with Megan for nine years. So I just really appreciate working with you and the friend that you’ve been. 

Megan: [01:04:20] No I appreciate you too Camille. 

Camille Johnson: [01:04:22] Thank you. Well, Megan, you are the expert on telling people about hikes in the area. 

Megan: [01:04:28] Yeah. 

Camille Johnson: [01:04:30] So there’s so many — 

Megan: [01:04:31] There are. 

Camille Johnson: [01:04:33] I don’t know how you would. Tell us actually how you do narrow down. Like if somebody walks in and they’re like, “Oh, I’m just looking for something to do.” 

Megan: [01:04:40] Well, if it was a local hike that they’re interested in, I recommend the Mansard hike. That’s a great hike. It’s quite a strenuous hike but it’s just east of town about six miles. It’s actually in a residential area. But it’s amazing because it’s pretty straight up. 

Camille Johnson: [01:05:00] It’s about 1000 feet elevation game. 

Megan: [01:05:04] So, your heart rate is — 

Camille Johnson: [01:05:06] You’re pumping and your legs feel it. 

Megan: [01:05:09] Yeah, when I first did it I didn’t like it. 

Camille Johnson: [01:05:12] It’s a challenge. 

Megan: [01:05:14] Yeah, definitely. It wasn’t one of my favorite hikes, but when you got there to the cove itself there’s lots and lots of petroglyphs and amazing — 

Camille Johnson: [01:05:26] Hundreds of years of the petroglyphs. It’s amazing. That’s a good one. 

Megan: [01:05:31] Little baby footprints. 

Camille Johnson: [01:05:33] Yes, even like the bear paw. And there’s an archer, there’s a big chicken which I have a theory and I brought this up on the episode of Dr. Titus that they saw the dinosaur prints and they were like, whoa, there is a big chicken guys. Watch out for the big chicken. So they have a big chicken. Then they have one person with, like, a bubble around the head, which I’m like, that looks like an alien. 

Hal Johnson: [01:05:58] Interesting. Wow. Like a helmet of sorts or something. Right? 

Camille Johnson: [01:06:04] I mean, you could spend hours just looking at all the petroglyphs. It’s mind-blowing. 

Hal Johnson: [01:06:10] When you sit in a residential area the trailhead is kind of at the edge of a residential area. Right? 

Megan: [01:06:14] Correct. 

Camille Johnson: [01:06:15] But on public land. 

Hal Johnson: [01:06:16] Okay. Perfect. Maybe one more. We had Mansard. And then what’s another one that just –?

Camille Johnson: [01:06:21] Maybe nonlocal, like?

Megan: [01:06:23] I would say Wire Pass is a pretty popular one. It’s down House Rock Valley Road but it’s pretty easy. Toadstool is a great one. That’s actually a really one that you don’t need a four-wheel drive or high clearance. You can drive right off the highway. There’s a big parking lot. It’s great for kids even for — 

Camille Johnson: [01:06:48] About 1-mile round trip, not tough. 

Megan: [01:06:50] Yeah. Yeah. 

Hal Johnson: [01:06:50] I was thinking maybe a mile. And it looks like an alien world in there. 

Megan: [01:06:53] It does. 

Hal Johnson: [01:06:53] It really does. 

Megan: [01:06:55] It looks like you’re on Mars. 

Hal Johnson: [01:06:56] Yeah. Foreign landscape. 

Camille Johnson: [01:06:57] Rock mushroom-type formations. 

Hal Johnson: [01:07:00] Rock pinnacles with a perfectly-balanced, several thousand-pound capstones on it. Right, perfectly balanced them. A bunch of them. It’s amazing. 

Megan: [01:07:09] Yeah, it’s amazing. 

Camille Johnson: [01:07:09] Then I like your suggestion of Wire Pass. People definitely love our Slot Canyons. They always perform very well. The imagery like when we post them on social media and Wire Pass is incredible. It ends up adjoining to the Buckskin Gulch, which is the longest, deepest Slot Canyon potentially in the world. We don’t know of a longer, deeper one, but we kind of are conservative in that what we say, we say usually North America, but it is a great narrow, tall Slot Canyon. 

Hal Johnson: [01:07:39] I think it’s a 21-miles long. It’s something in that – 

Camille Johnson: [01:07:42] I’ve heard. 21, 24, 26. I don’t know. Megan? 

Megan: [01:07:45] Somewhere in there. 

Camille Johnson: [01:07:46] Somewhere in there. Really long. 

Hal Johnson: [01:07:49] Over 20. Right. 

Camille Johnson: [01:07:50] But the one thing that I do, I do like to go in from Wire Pass and go to the Confluence where joins Buckskin Gulch and take kind of a left turn there. And then I just go for a while. Get some photos, usually sit down to lunch and then kind of go back and the lighting shifted and you get the images. So I’ve never done the full length of the Canyon, but it’s just incredible even for just a half-day hike or a couple hours. 

Hal Johnson: [01:08:18] Yeah. Yeah. Maybe a 30, 40-minute drive out to where, from Kanab to get there. 

Megan: [01:08:22] Like 38 miles. 

Hal Johnson: [01:08:26] Oh, 20 minutes. Okay. Got you. 

Camille Johnson: [01:08:28] No, it’s a pretty easy access. 

Megan: [01:08:30] Yeah it is. 

Hal Johnson: [01:08:31] Megan, thank you so very much. 

Megan: [01:08:33] Thank you. 

Hal Johnson: [01:08:35] You didn’t know you were going to be doing this. We appreciate you being a sport. And coming on it. 

Megan: [01:08:39] No I didn’t. Thanks. 

Camille Johnson: [01:08:37] She is a sport. 

Megan: [01:08:39] Anything for Camille. 

Hal Johnson: [01:08:40] There you go. 

Camille Johnson: [01:08:41] Thank you. Let’s give her a big round of applause.

Hal Johnson: [01:08:49] Well, Camille, that was so freaking fun. 

Camille Johnson: [01:08:50] It’s been so much fun. 

Hal Johnson: [01:08:52] Talking to these people and recapping. The season’s been great. Such interesting people interview so many stories to hear and talk to people about. 

Camille Johnson: [01:08:59] Absolutely. And I like what Emily said, I agree with her. Like our community, the people. our landscape is one thing, but really the value and the destination comes down to the people. Like if you come here and you don’t have a good experience, you’re likely not going to come back. But we get a lot of repeat and referral visitors because they feel so embraced by the community. I’ve sometimes compared our community members to a sour patch kid. There’s the sassy side and then there’s the, like, sweet gooey side, you know. So we’re a sassy population but we will also take care of you. If anything happens and you need somebody, we’re going to be there to help you. 

Hal Johnson: [01:09:40] Is it Emily that’s leading that sassy side just a little bit? 

Camille Johnson: [01:09:42] Yeah. She could be on that sassy end. Yes, Emily could be the poster child of the sour patch. 

Hal Johnson: [01:09:50] If I remember a Little New York and was a Georgia, some southern state. Yeah, that’s Southern Belle with some New York sass. I like it. 

Camille Johnson: [01:09:57] Yeah, we’ve got a lot of cool characters here that are just incredible people. And that’s what I would recommend is don’t just come here and stay on the perimeter of the community. When you stay in our communities, get to know the people, engage with the locals and I promise you it will amplify the quality of your experience. 

Hal Johnson: [01:10:18] So true. I hear that all the time when I’m on tours. People are so impressed and sometimes just blown away at the kindness and the willingness to share things and experiences of locals here. I think there’s probably almost every small town in America has that kind of a feel. But haven’t been in a lot of them either and I’m a little biased, I admit, but there’s something special here. There really is. 

Camille Johnson: [01:10:37] Well, and that’s, I think we, it may seem a little bit gimmicky or whatever the Magic of Kanab Podcast. But there really is a magical essence to this community. 

Hal Johnson: [01:10:47] Yes. Yes. You know, you finished it perfectly. The Magic of Kanab in the perfect essence. All right. Well, I’m thinking we’re going to wrap. This has been so fun, so good Camille.

Camille Johnson: [01:10:58] Yes. Thank you, Hal, you’ve been a great host. Thank you for taking this on and having all these conversations. 

Hal Johnson: [01:11:04] It’s a blast having you here today. And I’m just still a little sore about that Dr. Titus interview. We brought it up two or three times, but — 

Camille Johnson: [01:11:10] He is. So we’re going to have to get in with Dr. Titus soon. 

Hal Johnson: [01:11:13] I hope so. Well, we’ll sign off then. Thank you so very much to our listeners. Thank you for Relic, who produces our podcast and the Magic of Kanab. So thank you to our listeners who have been here with us and shared this journey and as we move forward in the future, we hope you’ll continue the journey with us and hope you will come back. 

Camille Johnson: [01:11:31] We’re here. Thank you so much. 

Hal Johnson: [01:11:33] Alright, thanks so much. 

[End of Transcript]